Prenups and divorce are not the same. Prenups have been demonized in the media. We are shown nasty divorces where one spouse is left starving and homeless as the other wallows in all of their greed and wealth, all because of a prenup.
This is so wrong on so many levels. As with many financial topics, the general public is left in the dark about the true intent and purpose of many financial tools. Prenups are a tool and when used properly, can create a strong harmonious relationship that is strengthened and not weakened. And our next guest is here to prove all the haters wrong, because as she says...
"You haven't landed on a good financial plan until everyone feels good about it...it's the same way with prenuptial agreements" -Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️
-Kaylin tells her first experience with legal documents after her father passed.
-A.B. Ridgeway breaks down the biggest threat to a family's net worth and it is not bad investment choices or even taxes
-Kaylin explains why she wants to help you keep Family Law out of your Family Choices
-Kaylin explains how to make transparency easier in a marriage
-Kaylin gives her top 3 favorite clauses in prenups that help ensure not just equality but equity when establishing the documents so everyone is happy
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About the show:
As Christians, we were taught to be good stewards over our tithing and giving to the less fortunate. But when it came to our personal finances and investing we were left clueless on what the Bible says. What does the Bible say about managing debt, leaving a legacy, investing, and planning for your retirement? Mr. Christian Finance answers these and many other questions because we want to teach you how to become rich and righteous!
Meet the Host:
A.B. Ridgeway, MBA (firstname.lastname@example.org) is the owner and Christian Financial Advisor with A.B. Ridgeway Wealth Management. With a decade in the finance industry, his goal is to give believers clarity around the most confusing topic in the Bible, money, and tithing. A.B. Ridgeway helps tithing Christians become cheerful givers but unlocking their money-making potential, so they can prosper and be the great stewards of the wealth God has entrusted them with.
Transcript [100% accuracy is not guaranteed and all transcriptions are for reference only.]
prenuptial agreement, people, agreement, prenup, couples, money, spouse, divorce, blended families, Kailyn, marriage, financial advisors, married, podcast, prenuptial, beneficiaries, children, plan, separate,
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️, Alajahwon Ridgeway
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 00:00
Our marriage could end. Nobody wants to think that could happen. I certainly didn't want to think that could happen. I also don't want to think that I could die, but I can. That just is the reality and the statistics on divorce are what they are. And I don't think anybody gets anywhere by pretending reality isn't what it and that all of a sudden marriages are just going to start always lasting forever.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 00:23
As Christians, we were taught to be good stewards over our tithing and giving to the less fortunate. But when it came to our own personal finances and investments, we are clueless on what the Bible says. What does the Bible say about managing debt? Leaving a legacy, investing, or even planning for retirement? We answer these and many other questions because we want to teach you how to be rich and righteous. If this is your first time to the show. We want to say welcome, if you're coming back for another spiritual refill. Welcome back. I am A.B. Ridgeway. And this is financial advisors say the darndest thing. Welcome back, I am A.B. Ridgeway, the host of financial advisors say the darndest things and my mom's favorite Christian financial advisor. With nearly a decade in the financial industry. I've helped hundreds of investors declutter their personal finances by providing investment strategies that align with the Word of God. So if you're an investor and you want to learn everything about God and money, like we do, stay tuned, because we will teach you how to become better at stewarding God's wealth, reducing the risk of outliving your money and becoming the steward leader. God has called you to be here. And that is what we are going to do for you today. Because we have a very special guest that is going to shake off the stigma of Prenuptial agreements. Now, hold on, hold on, hold on. I know what you're thinking. But there is a stigma around the word Prenuptial agreements, because we usually hear about them when a celebrity is getting a divorce or when someone divorced is getting remarried. Now, I love the joke by Chris Rock that says that rich people don't need Prenuptial agreements but poor people do. He says something along the lines of Frank Sinatra has $200 million that he loses half. I don't think that he was worried about living on $100 million. But if you only make $50,000 And you lose half, you're in trouble. But all jokes aside, I love this quote about prenups by Susan Meyers, president of the American Academy of matrimonial lawyers. Every single marriage ends, either by death or by divorce. Do you truly want the state to tell you how your estate is going to be divided in one of those events. Now taking control of your marriage is taking control of your finances and how they will work. And just like money, the money itself is not evil. But the intent behind the person using the money is and Prenuptial agreements are the same. See, prenuptial rules are not evil, but it is the intent of the person and why they decided to have a prenuptial agreement in the first place. As it says in Ezekiel, chapter 36, verse 26, and I will give you a new heart and a new spirit, and I will put within you and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And our next guest is going to share a sign of pre nuptials that you may never have considered, and hopefully give you a new heart and spirit around pre nuptials. So he's the owner of Kailyn Dillon financial planning, she helps couples thrive financially, regardless of how they define what's mine and what's ours. She simplifies the financial conversation and decisions that most busy couples either do not have time to take or find too messy to face alone. She received her certified financial planners designation from New York University, and one of the kindest spirits you will ever meet. Ladies and gentlemen, let's welcome Kailyn Dillon to the show. How you doing Kaylin?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 04:16
Hi, thank you. I'm really happy to be here. And that was really nice of you to say.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 04:23
No problem. No problem. Once again, thank you for coming on the show. I'm excited about this episode because our goal is to help tithing Christians with gifting strategies and passing on their wealth and they can't do that if they don't have any money to pass on. Or they don't know how their money is actually organized. So can you introduce yourself to everyone here and let us know who you are and who you serve.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 04:46
Hi, I'm Kaylin Dylan, and I'm a financial planner and I primarily help couples who have Prenuptial agreements already and I also have been Coaching couples that are working on getting Prenuptial agreements. But the focus of my business is on financial planning and financial advising clients that already have them,
Alajahwon Ridgeway 05:09
I want to first let everyone know who you are, because in my eyes, it is your story that really changed my perception, or my perspective for that matter on Prenuptial agreements. So can we kind of start with that story, you have a wonderful story about your dad and life insurance. And I was hoping that you would share this with us today.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 05:29
My first introduction to estate planning processes was when my dad died. I was 15. And his life insurance policy named my then step mother as beneficiary. But at the time, my dad had a divorce agreement in place with my mom that said, he was required to name me and my sister as the beneficiaries of any life insurance policy that he had. And that was his only policy, that was my first time learning that there's no authority watching over our legal agreements to make sure we're actually following them. Once you make a legal agreement, you just you're on your own to actually see it through. And I really thought that was crazy, because I highly doubt that there was bad intentions behind anybody's actions leading up to this agreement being broken. And it's just I think it's really easy for people to make agreements and not necessarily track and follow every detail of the agreements that they've made.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 06:30
So I have a question, when that policy went to effect, did they not name you, the beneficiaries? She renamed them to her children? How did that come about?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 06:39
I believe that we had been named correctly and that my dad had changed the beneficiary designation to his then wife. My guess is that we were I don't know this, for sure. But I think that we were named prior to him getting married, and that he changed at some time after getting married. And I think the span of time we're talking about is from the time he was divorced to the time he died was 10 years about, I don't know exactly when it was changed. But I don't have any reason to think that this was like a plot or anything like that. It was simply just a plan that didn't follow the agreement. So I
Alajahwon Ridgeway 07:17
get what you're saying. There was a communication breakdown, between maybe your father and his, his new wife,
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 07:24
maybe, or perhaps he didn't even remember exactly the terms that he had agreed to in the divorce agreement. I really mean, I really it's possible, he knew it's possible. He didn't remember, based on the number of couples that I've worked with that don't remember the terms of their own agreements. And I was, I mean, I fell into that category myself, I think it's perfectly plausible that he did just not remember after that much time, you know, why not change this to my beneficiary to my wife, I'm sure she'll take care of my children. And there's not really unless you have it worked into an agreement, there's not really a mechanism in place to check, you can put that in an agreement, actually, and I really recommend it. But to check somebody else's life insurance policy designation, if that wasn't in your agreements that like my mom could have checked the designation on a regular basis. It just kind of was what it was. And then you your only choices. Do you take this something like that to court? Do you have you really want to have a family dispute? Nobody wants to have to deal with that. I think anything that has to end up in court is worst case scenario.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 08:25
Right? I think in that case, everybody's grieving at that point, right. So everybody needs to focus on grieving as opposed to trying to go to court and argue 100%. So it's, I guess my, my comment would be this. We talked about wealth transfers a lot. We talk about estate planning on the show, and some of us have, some of my listeners have attended my webinar, where I talk about the biggest threats to your net worth, are not poor investment decisions. They're not even taxes. It is a communication breakdown between generation to generation. And we're going to talk about that a little bit later. As far as the greatest risk being left, well, I lost 2%, or 3% is like, well, when you start losing 10 and 20%, because of a wealth transfer, or you're not passing on your legacy, and your kids spend up all your money, you're gonna lose all of your net worth and everything that you've sacrificed so much for. So obviously, this event had a huge impact on your life, and how you conduct business and how you help other people. Now you're married. Now, can you tell us how that impacted the way that you approached your marriage?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 09:31
I can't say it was all just that event, but just experiencing divorce. And more than one divorce in my family and experiencing the loss of my father all made me take getting married very seriously. And it also made me I think, be more pragmatic about the possibility that our marriage could end. Nobody wants to think that that could happen. I certainly didn't want to think that could happen, I also don't want to think that I could die. But I can. That just is the reality. And the statistics on divorce are what they are. And I don't think anybody gets anywhere by pretending reality isn't what it is, and that all the sudden marriages are just going to start always lasting forever, I would say I took getting married very seriously. And I was young. So I was kind of clueless about a number of things at the same time, and we got a prenuptial agreement before we got married. And going into that process. I was totally clueless about what it would be like, but I had no problem with the idea of it, because I thought, you know, why not? Why not have a plan in place? seems totally reasonable. And based on all the conversations that we had had, they weren't detailed about what this agreement be, but they were about, you know, what would your expectations be? If things didn't work out? Or like, what if one of us doesn't work? Or what if one of us needs more help financially, things like that. We weren't having trouble getting on the same page at a high level. And so I thought, surely going getting a prenup is not going to be that difficult. The professionals will tell us what to do. And we'll just go through the process. And we'll end up with this agreement. And really quickly, it was a stressful tense process, because we didn't really know enough about Prenuptial agreements. The next thing we knew we were communicating between attorneys. And that was really difficult.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 11:32
A lot of people think that Prenuptial agreements are just about money. There are other moving parts, as far as court fees, and who's going to have the attorneys and things of that nature or other different dynamics. And we're going to dive into some of those too. So if you're just tuning in, make sure that you stay tuned, because we will talk about some of those aspects. But one thing I do like about you is that you have this idea that financial advisors are in a unique position to help families proactively keep family law out of their family choices. And one thing I do want to talk about is that if we don't proactively take control of these finances, we will end up in court and Kailyn is here to help you stay out of court. So having those conversations, and making sure that you and your spouse are on the same page can help mitigate some of that risk. And I want to make one more point here as well, because you said a lot of great things here, there is a difference between probability and possibility. The probability of divorce is high. But as Christians and people of faith with open communication, the possibility becomes lower. So we cannot deny the numbers of what divorce really is. And we have to include those who are in a secular world as well. But if your faith in your spouse and your relationship is strong, you don't have to worry about the probability, you really have to focus on the possibility. And that's where she focuses her attention. She says, Listen, how do we lower the possibility of view, losing your spouse over money conflicts, because we know statistically, that money is at the root of majority of divorces. And let's just be very clear out here. And I love this having this very open, honest conversation. Because if you truly love someone, you shouldn't be afraid to have those difficult conversations. The reason we're afraid to have those conversations is because we are fearful of what will come out of our spouse. So people aren't 100% Honest, they're holding something back, and we're afraid of that 10% They're holding, so we can be open. If we can be honest, if we can pray and be faithful. The prenuptial agreement should be no different than a contract to buy a mortgage. It should be no different than purchasing or CO signing for a car. They're both communication mechanisms. And they're both going to talk about what is going to happen if and then and that's what our job is. So let's start at the very, very beginning for those who may not know anything about Prenuptial agreements. Let's start them at the beginning. Let's assume now that there are children, but that they have no knowledge of the subject, but they have infinite wisdom. So if you just tell them exactly what it is they will understand what is the definition of a prenuptial agreement. We'll discuss what they are and what they are not prenuptial
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 14:11
agreement is a contract made prior to getting married between the two people who are getting married. And what makes it a prenuptial agreement is that it goes into effect upon the marriage taking place. So that is the definition. It does not have to be a plan for divorce. The majority of Prenuptial agreements do include terms that spell out how assets would be divided in a divorce, but you don't have to, you could just have a state terms that say here's what happens to my money when I die. And that's an especially good tool for blended families that are getting married for maybe a second time or some subsequent time. And they want to make sure their families are taken care of according to their wishes, as well. Was there a spouse, and a prenuptial agreement is a good way to do that. For those
Alajahwon Ridgeway 15:04
out there, can you give us an example of what that couple would look like
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 15:07
that couple is entering a second marriage, and each spouse has children from a prior relationship, they probably already own assets, one of them may own house, if not both of them, they probably already have investment accounts, they might even already have longtime relationships with a financial advisor or an insurance rep. I mean, they've, they have had established lives prior to blending their families and coming together. And to get married, they have some things that they are probably already particular about, or that they've already got earmarked for something, you know, here's a savings account that's really intended for this child, because I already helped this other child, or here's this inheritance that I already received, I want to make sure that goes to my children, not to my spouse, that may be something that is important to them.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 15:58
Let's talk about the compensation structure and like how that prenuptial agreement is set up. So I mean, you have some very smart individuals out here. And that's one thing I love about this show is that our listeners are very intelligent people. They're doctors, they're lawyers, you know, those are people who know their craft, they've mastered their craft, whether it's engineering or whatnot. And some of them are just a little embarrassed to say that they don't know how all these things work. So and that's why I always say is that we're not talking to them like they're a child, we're just talking to them as if they have no knowledge of the subject. But if given the opportunity and the information, they have infinite wisdom to figure it out. So a lot of them when they come to you, how are they emotionally or the stress? Are they sometimes calm? Is it into stressful situations? Explain that
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 16:47
a lot of times, the first thing that comes up in terms of emotions is embarrassment, like you said it, especially if they already have a prenuptial agreement in place, they are usually at least a little bit embarrassed that they don't totally understand all the details of it, especially if they've been married for a while. I think lawyers mean well, but I can't tell you how many attorneys I've heard say get the agreement done, because they know it's good advice to consider doing one. Because they see what it's like in court. Say they say get one done, but then get married filed away. Never look at it again. And I think it's I don't know where this came from. But I've heard it from multiple attorneys. And I think the the intention is good, but they're just trying to help people consider something that has a lot of stigma. And like whatever we can get someone to consider it is good. But really, you shouldn't just file it away. And you should make an agreement that you feel really good about, ideally be willing to revisit it. That means like be willing to revisit the terms to make sure you remember what they are. It's the same reason we review our wills and our trusts on a regular basis. It's the same reason your financial advisor reminds you to check your beneficiaries on a regular basis. It's amazing just things we forget things that fall through the cracks, things that have changed in our lives, and then we don't realize that matter to my will or to my trust or to my Prenuptial agreements. So ideally, you should agree to something you feel good about and you're happy to revisit on a regular basis,
Alajahwon Ridgeway 18:18
as you talk about Prenuptial agreements and what they are and the evolution of them is like a financial plan, like you said before is going to evolve, your marriage is going to do the same thing. And I was kind of I was kind of laughing kind of behind the mic when you said these lawyers tell you to have these Prenuptial agreements, put it in a drawer and you know, forget about it. And yes, that is a great step. Right. That's a great first step. But that's not the only step that you have to make. And I really liked that because I feel like as we said earlier in the conversation, it's the intent behind the person that determines how effective this Prenuptial agreements going to be. And people feel that what you wrote 10 years ago was how you feel today, maybe you want to give them more money. Maybe you want to change allocations, maybe a new child is in in the scenario and you want to give that child some money as well. Or maybe you know they had a stepchild and you didn't know you know, at the very beginning if you're going to adopt this into the whole family and now you're like, you know what, let me give them some some more money. I've grown to love them and care about them and and they respect the family unit that we have. So it is evolving. And I just think a lot of people think it is a dead document when it's really a living document. Can you take us through a scenario? Let's say that somebody comes to you do you have an example of where somebody has come to you they've needed some help. You've engaged with them you resolve that problem and how did that transform that relationship using that prenuptial agreement?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 19:47
I had a couple that came to me. We'll call them Lauren and Matthew, and they weren't bringing up the prenup as like their primary concern. Really what they wanted help with is just figuring out how do we make Make sure we're making the right choices. They had income from a few different places, Lauren had a share of a family business. So she had a little bit of income from that, in addition to her employment income. And Matthew had stock compensation, which they found overwhelming. And that's a whole other subject that people are very intelligent people are embarrassed to say they don't understand, and a lot of financial advisors don't understand. So I'd really like to just help people know that that is totally reasonable. And they didn't know, you know, when we do have cash, like, what's the best choice even make with this money? Should I be saving it for daughter's college savings, should I be keeping it in cash for a purchase, you know, they weren't sure like how to be sure they were really optimizing their choices. And it felt like the choices in front of them were starting to be just like more, they could graduate into another level that was little outside their comfort zone, less easy to Google. So working through some of that it, you know, we did make sure that we were looking at their prenuptial agreement, and it hadn't occurred to them to do that. But you know, that does really matter. Because if they have agreed that something should remain separate property, that's going to matter how you title and account, for instance, they felt, I think, really happy and relieved that we included this agreement in their plan, because they were both they were kind of in my situation, like they were both totally fine with the idea of getting one. But they didn't feel totally free of that stigma. So they didn't feel comfortable talking about it, they felt like it was something they shouldn't bring up in conversation. And it was because it was Lauren's family that first suggested this prenuptial agreement. There was also this feeling that, you know, maybe it wasn't totally like their decision to have gotten this agreement, I think they just felt really relieved to realize that they did have an agreement in place that made sense to both of them, and that they didn't have to feel ashamed of. And not only that, like, they could feel like, okay, we're taking this thing and treating it like adults should, and we're gonna put it in our financial plan, and we're gonna monitor it. And if we need to change it later, we'll change it and just took the lid off of this idea that it shouldn't be talked about, I think that alone was really valuable to them. It didn't have a drastic impact on their financial plan. But some of the little things really matter a lot when it comes to a legal agreement, like how you title an account.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 22:41
That's a whole can of worms there. And I'll just briefly touch on a few things. A lot of people think that this prenuptial agreement is just to divide assets. Okay, you get this and you get that, but sometimes think about it can protect your family as well. Because if you're in a very litigious industry, let's say that you're in law, and you get sued a lot, having a prenuptial agreement in place can protect some of your assets from being sued and being taken. And so sometimes you're even protecting the family. Can you speak a little bit about that aspect of protecting the assets from other creditors and things of that nature having a prenuptial agreement in place,
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 23:19
if you have named something as separate, then your spouse is not responsible for it. So yeah, if somebody's coming after you in a lawsuit, or creditors coming after you for debt that was named as separate debt, they can't. And in your agreement, you can include terms that make sure that applies even if your spouse dies. So you could be making sure that your spouse is not responsible for your debts, or for maybe a lawsuit or some thing that has come up after you've died. And I think that could be a really beautiful gift. Because again, that is another example like the last thing a grieving family wants to deal with is a lawsuit or creditors.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 24:08
And I love this aspect, because we don't talk about this aspect a lot, right? We don't talk about protecting our loved ones in case something happens to us or, you know, people come after us. So this prenuptial agreement is not this whole negative thing. Sometimes we want to make sure that with one spouse goes broke, all of us don't go broke and we can rebuild together. So let's take a jump here. We're gonna go over some challenges and I just want you to get some feedback on some of these typical challenges that we face with people who have Prenuptial agreements. So the first one is people who have a prenuptial agreement or separate interest, married later in life, already have financial advisors. One has a relationship. They have separate moving parts that made it too complicated to plan together. They're just a little bit too different. So can you address this couple and give them some advice and say, Okay, if you're in a situation like that, you're They're a bit later in life, you already have some financial advisors and things going on. How do you bring those people together,
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 25:06
when you're in that situation, it can feel so messy, it can feel like just the path of least resistance is to just kind of have separate plans. And I think there are a lot of financial advisors that kind of press that approach as well. Like if you have significant separate assets that you don't plan on going to your spouse, for instance, it's already earmarked for your children or some other intent. There are a lot of financial advisors that will tend to say, well, then you've got two separate financial plans. And I would say, even if even though it can really feel too messy, it's really not that difficult to get a joint plan together and plan your future together have a future vision that you share, that can still include separate goals that you don't share. But the overarching picture that you are creating for your future can be one that you create together, it's not that difficult to help a couple, make that plan together, I think it's kind of small stuff like me, making transparency easier. For instance, like, I make sure that all of my communications go to both spouses. And that's just period. So if I have a phone call with one client, one spouse, when I go to type up those notes, a copy of the notes go to both spouses, always every time there's no secret conversation happening. And I think in most, for most couples, there's no secret conversation that someone's even desiring to have. It's just, you know, we're just trying to be efficient, we're all busy. Sometimes it's easier for one spouse to make the call or send the email. But that doesn't mean that someone needs to be out of the loop. So sometimes it's some of these little things that just help encourage transparency and just a little more ease in the process of having a joint plan.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 27:06
You know, I love this, right? Because the very, very beginning. And I keep going back to the beginning, because we have this negative connotation around Prenuptial agreements, I told you, we're going to break this apart. So we're halfway through now. But we're breaking this thing apart piece by piece by piece. And there was something a nuance that I want my listeners to hear. She said, General, financial planners tend to take your recommendation and make two separate plans. You have your stuff. She has her stuff. Or vice versa. She has her stuff, he has this stuff, right. But the thing is, when you come to her firm, she says, I want you all together. So she's the prenuptial agreement expert. And she's the one who's telling you that you need to combine your assets and communicate and to get stronger and your marriage and your ability to share information. Do you see that? So you may be fretful like why don't want to go to a prenuptial agreement expert, because she's gonna want us that be separate. She's gonna want us to, you know, separate our assets and try to you know, let's break down that misconception. Once again, she's actually doing the opposite of what the industry standard is. So I want you to listen to this here, because we're gonna go a couple more examples if you don't mind that. Okay. Sure. Perfect, perfect. So what about that blended family? Second marriage, they have separate assets, you know, this whole blended families is not the same thing that we see in movies and in cultures, right. But the thing is, a blended family is not necessarily unique. And when we talk about statistical now, can you speak a little bit about that, right.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 28:43
Yeah, one of the top concerns that come up for blended families is how do we how do we divide our resources on an ongoing basis in a way that's fair to our children? Especially if the two spouses that have come together have different numbers of children? Say somebody has three, somebody has one? How do you treat them fairly, and that looks really different for every family. So this is another one of these things where you have not landed on a good plan until everybody feels good about it. And that's how I feel about Prenuptial agreements to a lot of times when couples are coming from different places, like I think this is how we should fund college for the kids. No, I and I think this is how we should fund college. I think they should have to stick take out student loans. I think we should try to find as much of it as possible. I think a lot of couples think when they if they bring that problem to someone else, a professional or financial planner, that they're going to tell them to compromise and meet in the middle Let's shoot to try to fund half of the college expense. That's not a reasonable solution if you don't feel good about it. And I can almost guarantee you, if those are your starting points, you're not going to feel good and neither party is going to feel good about funding 50%, they will both feel like they lost. So when it comes to Prenuptial agreements and blended families, figuring out how to divide up money, to be fair, things like that, really what the what most couples need to do is stop and take some steps back and figure out, you know, what's underneath those desires? What? Why, you know, what's your motivation with wanting to fund all as much of the college expenses as possible? What is your motivation for thinking they need to take out loans, if you the further down, you can dig and get at really what's underneath those desires, I promise you there are solutions that can feel good and and feel like you are addressing both of those desires alone that might not have anything to do with like exactly how much is in the college savings account. But right, there are solutions, because we're
Alajahwon Ridgeway 31:08
talking about self reflection, and you're asking people to identify their intentions and put their attentions on the table and not just your checkbook. I love that because it's that difference between equality and equity, you know, what is equal versus what is fair. And I don't want to make this point, I heard a saying a while ago, if somebody's heard it, or they can quote the author, please tag them or something like that. Let me know where I got it from. But the idea is that if you love your children equally, you will deal with him uniquely. So what that means is that each child has a special need that they need to be fulfilled. And they're not all the same. I have a daughter, she's she's 12 years old at the time, she has different needs than my son who's 11. And different than my, my son who's five, and my son who's four, they all have different needs, some need more hugs, some people need more tenants at volleyball games, but I deal with them uniquely. And I think the same thing, when we talk about money, maybe one of your children are self sufficient, maybe they don't need a lot of money, maybe they are getting a tons of scholarship, you don't have to worry about that. But maybe the other one, they may need a little bit of help. So having those conversations and that intent, and that self reflection is going to help you make a better decision. And like Kailyn said, When you come to a professional, we can ask those questions that the average investor doesn't know to ask not that you're not intelligent enough to ask those questions. But you just don't know what questions to ask yourself. And coming to Kailyn. She will address those for you. She'll say, Hey, these are the questions. This is what we're going to do. And we can move forward. So I love that love that love that. I can stay on this all day. But let's get to some solutions here. Right. So we've gone over the prototype of the person that you serve. We've talked about some case studies where you resolve some problems with Prenuptial agreements. We've identified what they are, what they're used for. We even talked about some of the challenges that you may see from some people who may be dealing with Prenuptial agreements or need Prenuptial agreements. But let's talk about solutions. Right. So what are some things that people can do to kind of resolve this perspective on Prenuptial agreements? Let's say they're in a situation. They know they need a prenuptial agreement. What would you say to those people to say, You know what, go ahead, go forward with it.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 33:29
My first piece of advice for them is get on the same page as much as possible prior to actually starting the process. So have some really frank conversations about why do you think you need a prenuptial agreement? And especially if it's just one person really asking for one versus the other. But both people need an opportunity to share? You know, if we're going to make this agreement, what are the underlying fears that you have, that this agreement could address? And, you know, we've all got underlying fears about the future. Some of them cannot be addressed in a prenuptial agreement. But, you know, bring up the ones you think maybe can and, and kind of do that that walking back process that I was describing, because if the more you understand someone's underlying desires and fears, the more comfortably you are going to be able to navigate that process of actually figuring out what terms should go in the agreement. So just know each other, as well as possible going into it.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 34:40
Perfect. So let's say that somebody, they hear you right there listening to this episode, they get you, they're gonna get on their Google machine and they're gonna start looking up different things. Do you have a resource because people want to hear from you? Right, because Google, we don't know who's writing that stuff. But they know that you're here. Do you have any tips that they can have or they can take advantage of that's going to help prepare them for prenuptial agreement or give them in the right direction. So they know what questions to ask.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 35:08
I have a guide on my website on my blog for couples to use. This is for like any kind of money conversation, but it's a guide for how to talk through a lot of these difficult conversations. So I recommend taking a look at that. For prenup specific resources. I don't I don't get any money for this. But there is a company called Hello prenup. And they're a really, really great resource just for educating yourself everything that they've researched to put together this online product and it's an online tool where you can make your own prenup, they have just put it on their website, they're not like holding it secret until you pay the fee. If you just want to go learn, you can just go to their website, they have a lot of states on there, they don't have every state. Even if your state's not on there, you can still learn a ton from them. And it's really digestible to and it's got a lot of suggestions for terms that you can include in a prenup, which is important because if you are if two people are coming from really different financial situations, in order to land on an agreement that you think is fair, you're going to need some creative clauses in there. Like, you know, if only one person has assets, and the other person only has debt prenuptial agreement that just protects that person's assets and makes that person's debt there's that's not going to feel very fair. No, in the end. There are a lot of suggestions out there for you know, other things you can include so that both parties really feel like this is an agreement that takes care of both of us.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 36:44
Awesome. That's great. So let's, let's talk about the cool stuff about Prenuptial agreements, right. So we we've actually broke down like said a lot of the stigmas, a lot of the things that we have preconceived in our mind. So at this point, all of our listeners should know that Prenuptial agreements should be very neutral when we are approaching them. I don't want you to be hot about them. I don't want you to be cold about them. I don't want you to think they're the greatest thing since sliced bread. And I don't want you to think that they're the most evil thing since you know, Satan, right. So I want you to have this neutral approach and says, Is this a tool that we can use to help facilitate our family forward and manage our finances? That's how I want you to look at it. Okay. So I don't want you to say, oh, oh, they have a prenuptial agreement, they must not be doing well in their marriage. I'm sorry to say this, but the majority people don't have Prenuptial agreements. And the statistics are still high. So let's stop associated. Is there a difference between correlation and causation? There's two difference. Okay. So let's talk about the cool thing. So give me your top three cool things about a prenuptial agreement that people like, wow, that is awesome. Okay, I do like that.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 37:55
My favorite thing about prenups is that you can include terms that would compensate a spouse for leaving their job to take care of the family. And I just, I mean, in a world where it feels like, it's hard to feel valued when you are the spouse that stays home, I'm not in that position. But I know that's a struggle. This is something you could put an agreement in an agreement that literally says this work is monetarily valuable. And in some way, my second favorite thing you can do with a prenuptial agreement is include estate terms that say what would happen to your assets at death. And the reason I love that is because both spouses have to agree to make a change to it. Now, if you wait, and you just put those terms in a will instead, anyone can go change their will anytime. And only one person has to make those changes. But if it's in your prenuptial agreement, you both have to agree to make changes later. So if someone you know, wants to include some friend or distant relative and the other spouse is like, I'm not so sure I think they're playing you. Or you know, they're feeling suspicious, you know, like, you get to both be a part of that decision if those terms are in your prenuptial agreement.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 39:17
As long as I get one more, I get one more. I'm gonna squeeze squeeze you out
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 39:21
one more favorite thing? Well, kind of a fun thing that I'm seeing is that people you can include terms around who would get a pet. So who would have rights to a pet if they got divorced. And like one of the couples that I talked to recently, they have three cats, and they decided two cats would go to one spouse as they got divorced and one cat would go to the other. And I asked how they made that decision because they got all their pets together when they were already in a relationship and they said it was purely based on just the cats like best. It's already clear to them With the cats like? And I did ask them has that affected their relationship with their cats? You know, knowing like, hey, that's your cat. Like they laughed. They said, Absolutely not. It's just I mean, it's just an agreement that of course, but you know, hopefully they never need just like insurance. And you know, I get insurance and it doesn't affect me. I don't, I don't think more about death after having life insurance.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 40:28
That's big, because that's one of the biggest challenges for life insurance do people are afraid to talk about death, they're afraid to talk about what's going to happen if one of us passes away too soon, or, you know, God calls us home, right? We're all on God's timing. So we never know when things are going to happen. Like you said before, it's either going to be by death, or it's going to be by divorce, you know, there's only one or two ways that this is going to occur. I do want to shout out a few of my clients here because they are pet lovers. So their pets are like their children, as well. So I definitely want to say hello to them, because they are very close to my heart. They know who they are. I'm not going to say their names. But the initials are BP. But you know, thank you for being one of my great clients. At our firm, we really really enjoy him and his his wife and their cats as well. So with that said, Kaylin, we are going to play a little game. If you've been listening to the show, it is one of our favorite games is called Tin.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 41:30
And not to be confused with this case study for
Alajahwon Ridgeway 41:33
30 Because I don't want to get sued. But this is where our guests answers 10 questions, and they get 10 seconds to answer each one. Are you reading so? You're sure that all right, ladies and gentlemen, so we are going to start this game? And what that means if Kailyn gets the right answer, you will hear a if she gets it wrong, you will hear a question number one, many people believe that if you didn't sign a prenuptial agreement that it's too late, but we know that is false. We discussed post nuptial agreements. And with that said, Can you name a circumstance when someone would consider a post nuptial agreement?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 42:14
Somebody's leaving their job to take care of the family is a really common and great, great scenario to consider a post nuptial agreement.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 42:24
All right, question number two, what is something that can nullify a prenuptial and not make it enforceable?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 42:32
Usually if a prenuptial agreement was made under coercion, which you would need to be able to prove or distress or like, you know, in the hallway at the church, before the wedding, that sort of thing.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 42:50
We only got 10 seconds, and we only have 10 sec.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 42:53
Okay, okay. I thought it was like 10 seconds to start answering. Okay, two seconds per question. It's
Alajahwon Ridgeway 43:01
like, it's okay. It's okay. That's the name of the game. So one of them one. That's okay. Number three, do Prenuptial agreements include children in custody?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 43:13
No, they cannot.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 43:15
Number four, what do you do if parties move from one state to another? In which day is the prenuptial agreement enforceable, and will they need to create a new one?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 43:25
The prenup is enforceable in any state. And the states respect each other's Prenuptial agreements just like wills and trusts.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 43:36
Number five, if someone is misled in the process, are there any recourse a person can take to amend the document once it is signed?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 43:44
Yeah, you can amend a prenuptial agreement. And that would probably be in the form of a post nuptial agreement or you could just amend it. Yeah.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 43:52
Number six, why should someone choose you? Over a general financial planner who just talks about being a fiduciary?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 44:00
Someone should choose me because I believe there are no situations where couples can't get on the same page.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 44:07
Number seven, how can someone reach out to you and you can say your website
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 44:12
on Instagram at Kailyn Dylan financial
Alajahwon Ridgeway 44:16
number eight. What's your favorite prenup clause?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 44:19
My favorite I said was really that compensation for leaving a job is really my favorite.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 44:27
Number nine, what's one thing couples should know before they get a prenup?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 44:32
They should know how important it is to get on the same page before they really start the process and just educate themselves.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 44:42
Number 10 down in Cajun country, in the southern Louisiana State, we have a seasoning called Creole seasoning. And the nickname is the Holy Trinity. Can you name the ingredients?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 44:56
Oh man. I am not going to doubt my husband would definitely know paprika,
Alajahwon Ridgeway 45:10
bell peppers, onions, and celery, the Holy Trinity the holy, real seizing what everything is stuff down here,
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 45:19
I might have marriage problems after getting that one wrong.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 45:23
Well, you did an excellent job on Tim for Tim, please, please give yourself a round of applause. But give yourself a round of applause. I really appreciate you coming on to the show. Is there anything that you want to say to our listeners, let them know where they can get in contact with you? Because I want to make sure that everyone who has a prenuptial circumstance in which they need to resolve or they need to implement, I want to make sure that they reach out to you.
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 45:47
Yeah, they can reach me at my website, it's Kailyn Dillon financial.com. That's also my calendar. And financial is my name on most social media. So you can find me on most platforms. The only other thing that I just really want people to know is that there is no reason no circumstance where two people can't really feel great about their future together.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 46:08
That was beautiful. That is beautiful. And, and I wouldn't be remiss, and I know we're about to go. But I want you to talk about your book. Just real quickly. Please, please, please bring up your book. I don't want to leave the podcast without
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 46:21
I am working on a book. It's going to be a guide for couples that are considering a prenuptial agreement or they already have one and it will walk them through what should we consider prior to starting the process? What are our options for getting one and pros and cons of each approach? As well as what should we be keeping in mind while we're managing our fantasy finances during marriage also includes a lot of personal stories from people that have had Prenuptial agreements or wished they had one. It's been a really great way to gather some people's stories that I think will be good for people to hear. Because too often, we think we're the only people in our situation. And most of the time, it's not the case. Most of most money things and marriage things are pretty common. We just aren't comfortable talking about it.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 47:08
And please, Kaylin, where can they email you reach out to you just in case they're like, You know what I love this book. Sounds great. I want to get on the mailing list because when it comes out, I want to get it. Where can they send an email when they go to your website?
Kaylin Dillon, CFP®️ 47:21
Yep, you can my email addresses right on my website. Kailyn Dylan financial.com You can sign up for the newsletter there you will the newsletter will certainly announce once the book is available. There's also a contact form on there.
Alajahwon Ridgeway 47:33
That's perfect. That's perfect. Well, my tithing titans in my gifting gals that is it from financial advisors say the darndest things. If you're not subscribed to our show, and I want you to receive this Christian resources if you're not is for biblical principles every Christian should know about investing in creating generational wealth. Just go to www dot ABR wealth management.com backslash podcast into your name and email and start fellowshipping with 1000s of listeners and tiding Christians just like you stay informed on upcoming guests download free Christian resources and be notified of special access codes for bonus material. Thank you, Kaylin for coming on to the show you have been a blessing. And once again, I am AB Ridgeway and I'll see you on the other side of your blessing. I hope that you've been blessed as always, this episode was created by AB Ridgeway owner of AB Ridgeway wealth management, a virtual and in person fee only advisor that believes that financial advice should have gotten in it. If you need help figuring out your finances, feel free to reach out to us at 337-414-3686 or visit our website at WWW dot ABR wealth management.com and schedule a free consultation. new episodes are available every Friday so be sure to subscribe. You can also listen to our podcasts on your favorite platforms, Amazon Music, Spotify, Google podcasts, Apple podcasts and more. Or simply visit our website and join our family. I am AB Ridgeway and I'll see you on the other side of your blessing. Elijah one originally is an investment advisor representative and owner of AB Ridgeway Wealth Management LLC, a registered investment advisor which produces a podcast show and makes it available on his website and through other distribution channels. Elijah will rejoin any guests on the podcast providing their own views and opinion are not necessarily the views and opinions of AB Ridgeway wealth management that them on podcast should be construed as solicitation or offer or recommendation to buy or sell any specific security. Investment Advisory Services are only provides investors to become AB Ridgeway Wealth Management client pursuant to a written Investment Management Agreement. Clients of AB Ridgeway wealth management may hold positions and securities discussed in the podcast. Past performance is no guarantee of future results. All investments involve risk and may lose money. financial advisors say the darndest thing podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be relied on for any investment decisions. Instead, please consult a financial advisor, accountant attorney and or conduct your own due diligence